spiritual aspect of preparing
 

Are others also feeling this need to prepare is tied into spiritual events? If so how are you dealing with this

On another site I post on many people say they are going through many emotional and spiritual changes as they prepare. There is a sensation that life seems to move much faster, that everything feels hard and difficult, relationships and marriages are ending. Tolerance for lies and BS is fading.

On a personal level I feel like a salmon swimming upstream having to fight everyone around me. I also feel that preparing with physical preparation is not enough and mental and spiritual preparation is in order. There is also a nagging voice saying its time to get off my comfortable butt and get my body in fighting shape. Those voices are becoming as strong as the one that said buy guns, food and ammo. Are others feeling this or do I need to tell the voices to stop. :banghead:

Re: spiritual aspect of preparing
 

Feeling it too.

Perepared spiritually for it years ago. Preparing physically for it now. Never had such a sense of urgency as I have lately.

Getting a warriors mentality is not something politically correct, but necessary for survival.

I know i wouldn't have a problem (mentaly) defending my family from those that would do us harm. What I struggle with is when i meet the single mom with a 3 year old starving to death. Do I turn my back and just take care of my family?

It's easy to say "Yeah, their fault for not prepping". But it's not that simple. There will be many moral choices we'll be forced to make that test our resolve.

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The most important thing is to make peace with whatever god or higher power floats your boat. When you no longer fear death, you are empowered to think and act more clearly.

My wife has been having a hard time dealing with the possibility that things could get very bad -- she would rather go on the extravagant vacation than prepare for TSHTF. She acknowledges that I have been right about things I have said that have come to pass, but she sure doesn't want me to be right about TSHTF. Hell, I don't want to be right about it, either! But as I always say to her "I'd rather be wrong and prepared, than right and unprepared!"

The biggest fear that drives me is not the thought of what will happen to me, but what will happen to my children, which I'm sure is the case with most parents.

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Silver jeep, you bring up a good point about turning others away if things get bad. I'm not sure I want to live through a situation like that. Quite honeslty I dont see myself as Survivor material.

eyeofliberty, ditto. "The biggest fear that drives me is not the thought of what will happen to me, but what will happen to my children, which I'm sure is the case with most parents."

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If you have any connection to your spiritual side or feel the need for preparing that part of your situation then you must most definately ask yourself how you will treat your fellow man in a survival situation.

I've read too many posts here about hunkering down with your family, dogs and guns ready to repel ANYBODY that comes by. And to hell with those that did not have the foresight to prepare.

As a species, we have gained the heights we have by our ability to socialize. As a group, tribe, village, country...by supporting each other we do far better.

Those that talk about shooting in self defense; have you thought about how that will feel? Our T.V. generated perception of shooting someone is that the person shot conviently falls down asleep with maybe a slight red stain to show for it.
Are you prepared for the screaming of a wounded person? How about their pleas for help as they lay dying? How will you handle seeing someone's guts strewn around from a simple belly wound? Measure your apparent ability to shoot someone with a veteran who has 'been there/done that' (if you can get them to talk about it at all).

To turn away a human in need or starving is what we currently hold contemptable on the world stage.
Yes, we all may be faced with the question of having limited resources and suddenly having someone ask you to share those resources. What level of spiritual being will you come to see yourself to be?

I have asked myself about both scenarios.
I will shoot in self defense and defense of those being subjected to violence.
I hope I will have the humanity to puke my guts out later, even if such a shooting were justifed.
I will share what I have with my fellow man to the best of my ability. Although I will also expect them to contribute (somehow) to my survival also.
If you are in need, then join me. Together we will do better.

Re: spiritual aspect of preparing
 

Not survival material, huh? Coulda fooled me.

Lt Dan, what's wrong with the voices?? Just make sure you listen to the right ones.

Politically correct. Trust me, when people get real hungry that will be the last thing on their minds.

As for what to do with a Mother and a starving child, feed them. Give them water. Will it depleat your resources quicker, yes! But we are not islands. We live and die with the neighbors we have. If they need protection, protect them. I know you can't take on the world and resources will be limited(to say the least). If you can't feed them, comfort them. Encourage people. Many will slip into depression and give up. Get them on their feet. Help them plant gardens. Many will die. Many won't.

Etc,etc,etc Just DON'T GIVE UP!!!!!


SB

Re: spiritual aspect of preparing
 

Spirit is too deep and personal a subject to take up here. Without it, however, in chaos you will be anchorless and rudderless. I don't see that at promoting long-term survival.

Too often people are not seeing others as a resource and not a liability. They can be a liability, yes. But you must know that without others, you would not survive, so therefore you must include others. Many others. And your community is your foundation.

As for starvation and death, we all die. No matter how prepared, how many you shoot or how many you let starve, you will die. No one knows if that will be from accident, illness, old age, violence, or heroism, but you can be certain it will happen.

Does it matter so much if it happens early or later? Would it matter more to live one's life with honor and not cowering from death?

Do what you think is right, but know it will not save you. There are larger things than this.

TS

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TS

There are not larger things that this.
This is what the 'larger things' are about.
What we believe, how we live what we believe, how we treat our fellow man, sanctity of life and how we treat our planet earth and the life we have been given.
These things are what makes up the 'larger things'.

Re: spiritual aspect of preparing
 

This is a no brainer. If someone was hungry, I would never hesitate to give them food. What better example for your children?

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Some days talking to the voices is the only intelligent conversation I get.

Re: spiritual aspect of preparing
 

I don't think anyone can say with certainty what they will do when faced with their family starving, or giving their food away to others. Do you starve your child to feed a relative? It's easy to say I will take care of my neighbors, and my family, until the resources start running low, and you have to make that crucial choice as to who gets what. I guess you can save the women and children first.

Yes, you need people from a spiritual pespective, what type of life would be worth living just to survive, yes I think some people will be compassionate at first, but I believe when the rubber hits the road, I wonder how long that compassion will hold out if your own flesh and blood are starving so you can be the good neighbor.

I just don't think anyone can foretell what they will really do if and when the time ever came and they were forced into making resource allocations, I don't believe it will be spiritual at this point (just my opinion) it'll be surival instinct that comes into play.

I don't judge people too harshly for wanting to protect their families first and foremost. I will not personally sacrifice my family for anyone else's, just as don't expect too many people to sacrifice their's for yours...if it gets that bad, (and I think it's dog-eat-dog now).

Collectively a group is stronger than one individual, absolutely, but not if collectively everyone is living off what one person prepped for alone. It's a nice thought to work with your neighbors until you find they are ripping you off blind when your back is turned. If you don't have a group put together to start with, it'll be very difficult to put one together that you can trust AFTER the fact.

Just look in the workplace and the people you work with and how they behave WITH food; look at your family members and how they behave WITH food, now think how they would behave in a group with very limited food, that is not their's to do what they want with. Tell your 300 lb. SIL she can only have one can of food a day (then lock the food up until the next day if you still want it there).

All easier said than done, and if you're starving, you might have second thoughts about how much you are going to share, again, just my opinion, not trying to offend anyone. Just something to ponder.

Re: spiritual aspect of preparing
 

I got extra non hybrid garden seed to share with my community but the only way I plan to share food put by for my household is by not being in the bread line. Which leaves more for others there, and is therefore still a plus.

Now if things time out so that my investments do very well during the toughest times, we intend to try to capitalize local small businesses that make useful things like low energy demand heat or cooling or transport or local food production. Our lifestyle will remain modest. But 100 people starving after 2 weeks using up my household's pantry is not really any help. And our close friends we will watch out for hunger with, though I think most have prepped, just not as much as they may need. This community has a lot of local food production, so I think it will be more a case of less variety, not outright starvation, for those who are not prepared.

In some worst case scenarios all humankind perishes, but I think a middle case is where we are headed here. People accustomed to eating out at nice places every meal may get their first introduction to living on grain mush mostly, which will be a horrible shock, but not starvation.

I do have a strong sense that we are all in this together, and need to help each other in practical ways. I feel spiritual preparation is why I even noticed what was coming.

One friend reminds me of the 300lb SIL you mention. I told her bluntly the 3rd time she mentioned depending on me for 'x' and giggling that their household income exceeded ours and if she did not buy what she would need now and kept buying status things while we drove 20 year old vehicles, etc, that she would not be getting 'x' or 'y' or 'z' from us. She took it hard, and it ran as an undecurrent in dealings between our 2 households for almost a year, but they seem to be thinking better and prepping more now. Nearly debt free, he's in bicycle range to work, and commuting that way... much better. I have not asked about a full pantry because it got so touchy, but I am hopeful from these other signs.

The 80 something woman I know from meals on wheels I would take under our protection if her surviving sons did not. They are not local and might not survive they are in such large cities. I would be willing to take her in as if she were family and care for her in our home. She is just barely able to live in her own home right now, but will need some kind of assisted living soon. She is a pistol, brave and funny. Saw the previous depression as a child and had it harder than my parents. And we would try to barter in a fair way with others who may have nothing saved for their work on any projects we undertook. We know some whose small businesses are already pinched and we already stretch our budget to hire them more than we otherwise would. But not wastefully.

So our plan is to be frugal ourselves and deal honestly with others in mutually helpful ways.

I hope it does not come to a starving mother at our door. It won't here unless made to do so by violence. There is enough local food. There will only be hunger if some psycho wants to live in luxury off the misery of others by selling it away backed by guns.

Which is exactly how many are starving in the world right now. Some creep who jets around to shop for extravagant things all over the world sells cut flowers to our supermarkets and that land no longer grows food for the local ordinary person.

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I have been seriously involved in bodybuilding and powerlifting training my whole life from age 15 until about 3 years ago. I was a 500 pound bench presser and in good overall shape at 34. I'm now 37 and have let myself go to pot for the last three years. I just got really burned out on it after all those years under the iron. The last few weeks I've felt a stirring to get back into full bore training both with the weights and the smattering of martial arts I have done here and there in the past. I started training a bit a couple of weeks ago and am now struggling to get my diet cleaned up. I hope to have myself back close to where I used to be in about a year. I don't know if I'm nuts or what but I just feel that its time to prepare myself to be the best that I can be in all areas. I've got a wife, a 5 year old son, and nearly 3 year old daughter to take care of. If I'm wrong it won't hurt anything to get myself back in shape. I'm in pretty decent shape on my other preps.

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Greetings from Tazewell, Tennessee. If you don�t mind my asking, where are you in Northeast Tennessee? There are a few of us hillbillies here at GIM.

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I'm in Carter County. Elizabethton area.

Re: spiritual aspect of preparing
 

That's up in TN Andys neck of the woods. If you're ever down around Tazewell, Stop in, I'm the antique store just before you get to Tazewell. Just a couple of months ago my wife and I were in Gray, went to the fossil museum, great place!

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There's a gun show in Gray in about two weeks. I may make it for that. Are you planning to go?

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When, Where And Whose Show (RK)? I'll probably be there. I'm easy to spot my avitar is a recent picture.

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It's 2/16 and 2/17 at the appalachian fairgrounds in Gray.

Re: spiritual aspect of preparing
 

Love the new av, Jaima!

For me, the journey of "preparing" has been a movement away from consuming and into producing. This movement ("opting out of the system") has had a spiritual impact on me to the degree that living independent of society has made me more dependent on creation and more thankful to the Creator. It isn't as much of a spiritual awakening to me as it has been a spiritual experience. It feels good to take my dependence off of the utility companies and the grocery stores and put my dependence on God to "give us our daily bread" and provide the fuel to warm our shelter.

This has also worked in us a deep contentment and appreciation for things which we used to take for granted. We are living simpler, happier, less distracted lives. It is as though the noise of society has been muted and our senses are awakening to the way our ancestors used to live - in direct contact with nature.

Re: spiritual aspect of preparing
 

My wife is the same way. I get a charge out of prep's, she doesn't want to think about it, and would rather go on vacation.

I try to focus on being wholly prepped. Spiritually, emotionally, physically. Area's of focus are required in finances, how you store your wealth (PM's!!), and practical needs. Be certain to stave off fear! Fear kills by immobilizing you.

Don McAlvaney used to talk about not pulling the trigger on large preps too soon, or too late. Balance, watchfulness, and good timing. Staying up on stuff and not being too emotionally invested in the doom and gloom thing is important to stay fluid.

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most recently mental preparation has become more important to me than logicistical preparation.

part of that has been breaking out the old testament and going through that.

Re: spiritual aspect of preparing
 

I hope you make it through. I'd recommend skipping through the Bible. Here is a good path to read in the OT to get the historical perspective: Genesis, Exodus, Numbers, Joshua, Judges, 1 Samuel, 2 Samuel, 1 Kings, 2 Kings, Daniel. In the NT you should read John, Romans (and Hebrews for extra credit), Galatians, Revelation. This will give you the "Cliffs Notes" overview.

Be sure to read from the NASB if you want the most accurate translation and the NIV if you want the most readable translation. Good luck. PM with questions.

Re: spiritual aspect of preparing
 

As always, you've thoughly thought it through. You are so practical and down to earth, with a heart too, but not unrealistic. I am with you on this, obviously I would not want to see any one die when I could have helped out, but again, it goes back too, like you bluntly said to your friend (and I said to my sister) prepare else you aren't going to get "x" "y" and "z" as my hubby and I are also driving very old vehicles, etc. and sacrificing to stock and stay out of debt (although I can't really say it's a sacrifice driving an older vehicle, gets yeah from point A to point B, still have a vehicle so I'm not whining).

I would take my husband's mom/grandmother in a heartbeat and take care of them, no way would I allow them to suffer at their age...I'm speaking of people that, like your friend, throw it in your face about how "well" they are doing, are squandering their resources, but then will want you to bail them out when TSHTF.

I also like your thinking about how to help out your community, I would do the same if in the position, I am all for helping each other out, I'm not for the slackers and something for nothing crowd knocking on my door though, so yes, to a certain extent I have a heart, but I also know I will have to draw some lines in the sand IF it gets so bad we have too.

I would glady donate part of my property as a community effort for people that wanted to grow food, as long as it was equally shared for ALL, and I would glady lend out my animals for work, again, shared, and my husband would gladly help out neighbors with mechanic work if they are desparate and he has the time/resources, but again, everyone would need to SHARE in the effort, and nowdays, what I see are too many people that are selfish, and I guess what I'm getting at, is I'm willing to pitch in/help out, if others are willing to do the same, I'm not willing to have extended family members that have been 100% irresponsible use up our resources and then go on to the next "victim" even if they are family, and definetly not willing to go that route with "neighbors". So, I guess I have mentally prepared for that line in the sand IF it comes to that.

I somehow think we'll still have food, it'll just be limited in supply and limited in what you can get. I'm all for the barter system. And I'm fully invested in attending town meetings when TSHTF, if it does in a big way, to try and help people organize and see who can do what, who can barter with who, and how we can make it work as a community, but I'm not 100% fully invested in giving my resources away just to be the good neighbor.

If people want to be sefish, I will be as selfish I guess is what I am saying, either you are in on the community effort, or you're a loner, I don't think any community in a SHTF situation is going to tolerate and just be "nice" to slackers, theives, cheats, or those that are just plain lazy. No doubt you will help out the disabled and elderly, but the local alcoholic/drug addict, scam artist, little piggy, and slackers, well I just don't see a community in a SHTF situation showing much tolerance or compassion, unless they clean up their act and find a way to contribute along with everyone else.

I look at the homeless on the street, I wouldn't give them money, but with resources, I would buy them food, it won't be any different in a SHTF situation, other than, now who gets the food and how much? You would almost have to base it on effort in a sense, because those that are expending the most energy to help the rest of the group, deserve more energy in return.

It reminds me of when we were kids and had to ration food, oh yes, big family, tight budget when work was slow. It went like this, Dad went out and earned the money, if we only had "x" pork chops, guess who got 2? Guess who got 1? The kids got one, Dad, who was out doing physical work (carpentry, pipefitting, millrighting) got the food...it was real simple, and we KNEW better than to ask for that last porkchop (because my Dad would give it to us, he had a heart) but we also knew he needed the food as his job required it, ours (going to school) didn't require the same caloric intake.

Old timers had it right about allocation of resources. Also, Dad always got a real breakfast, eggs, potatoes, meat, us kids, here's the Rick Krispies and milk and you only get 1 teaspoon of sugar, and here's a 4 oz glass of orange juice and a slice of toast, and don't use too much butter.

The food was rationed based on who was expending the most energy and who was bringing home the bacon, in a SHTF situation, I don't see it being any different, are you going to starve your laborers or your children/own family to feed your 300 lb. SIL or town alcoholic or addict? To me, there is no question of who will be first in line to feed, nurture and support.

Anyway, I'll get off my soapbox, again, I really appreciate your input AM for PM, it's always very well balanced and thought out. Sometimes I don't always think it all the way through, and have to go back, and go, yeah, they have a point.

Re: spiritual aspect of preparing
 

SLV, nice post.

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Jaima,

If you are getting A Witness from God to prepare, and you Know HIM Pesonally and Directly, what is there to consider? HE Guides and makes our way. With many of HIS People this has been a longtime preparation. Others maybe just finally decided to listen.

If you think of your money as HIS, you will have few qualms about deploying it and praying for Guidance on how. We Knew, (had Witness), for years that others would be dependent upon us and led to us for safeharbor. Extra clothing and food, linens, gear etc are here and ready. Not like you need a whole lot. After all, the widow who sustained Elijah had only enough for one loaf of bread when he came under her roof.

Don't neglect the self-defense aspect either. God is not preserving HIS People to be martyred, or to stand helpless while other innocents are. Those days are gone. Those fighting with and for the enemy have spurned God, so the living witness of self-sacrifice has no impact upon them.

If you Know God, have a direct Relationship With HIM, you Know you need no one else to shepherd you. In-HIM we need only HIM.

If you are confident and Trust HIM Fully, you cannot be thwarted. Abiding In-HIM and doing HIS Will is what HIS Church is all about. When things seem confusing, and they will; just turn your thoughts to HIM, seek that conscious contact and The Witness of The Holy Spirit will Guide you.

These are the Final Moments and soon all will Know.
Maranatha!!!

Re: spiritual aspect of preparing
 

I guess I'm saying there are worse things than dying a little earlier because you shared your food with widows and orphans.

The other is a good point that I took for granted. You cannot give away because there will immediately be too much need and too few goods. It goes without saying that only those who work will eat. Because...if we were all working, ALL would eat. I mean, we are now, aren't we? What causes starvation is when people don't work, or more importantly, aren't allowed, or the tools that make it possible (like seeds) are taken away.

None will eat who do not work. I seem to remember some guy Saul once said something about that. If you make that a rule, and focus on preparing for production, I don't see why many near to you should starve for long. If you had two sheep, how many would you have in 5 years?

Fibonacci (using the very case for which this formula was invented) 2+3+5+8+13+21. If you want to create, you will find the earth astoundingly productive.

For this, seeds are the thing you will most need. Smallest, long storing, easy to hand out because THEY will do the work...Or THEY will starve. If they come to you, what more is there but that you are no better than they and only have your seeds too? Do a fibonacci on corn ears, which multiply at near 300:1.

TS

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Hi Jaima

The way is killing our ego with our Divine Mother. Mystical Death.

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Aw come'on, Hive! Don't throw in the towel!

Lately I've "realized" something obvious -- I CAN change ANY aspect of my life. Some things are easier than others; some things cost more than others. But ANYTHING can be changed. Big change is just the result of persistent and consistent little changes. My life right now is the product of my past actions. My past actions were the result of my past thinking. My FUTURE will be the result of my present actions, and my present actions will be predicated on my present thinking.

We give ourselves so many "reasons" (excuses) why we can't change this or that. Usually it is nothing more than bad thinking -- our mind is holding us back. Quite often we are afraid of what other people will think (even and especially family). This is my biggest drag - what will my parents think. I love and have a lot of respect for my dad, and just like any son I've always wanted him to be pleased with me. But at some point we all have to look at our lives and say, "I have to do what is right for me."

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One of the best "survival" novels ever, is Lucifer's Hammer by Niven and Pournelle. Hive, one of the characters is a diabetic PHD who is at ground central when the disaster hits, but prepared for it. His inteligence and determination overcomes many prospective disasters in his travel to safeharbor up in the Sierra foothills.

I say if you do what you can, and think through some "what if's" and come up with plans you can modify as you go along, you will be much better prepared than someone who has all the gear but doesn't know how to use it and doesn't have a plan mapped out that he/she can follow. Reaction to events is not nearly as effective as calculated response.

Maybe you do things like keep full fuel tanks in your vehicles and some spare fuel on hand. Have a good reserve of canned or camping foods. Spend some time looking at street maps and county road maps for backroads to where you might want to go. Then get out and drive the routes you looked at. If you are in LA, obviously, you try to stay out of the gang territories or don't go through in a high profile manner.

We all have a lot to offer in terms of experience and capablilities. Knowing how to articulate what you know to others may be a big help to you.

Maybe you have relatives or friends in some small town or outlying areas? Know someone with a remote cabin? You might broach the subject of "what're you gonna do if...", to them; and then listen. There are lots of places to go camping in CA. If you happen to be there with a carload of gear and supplies, on a camping trip, wouldn't that be fortunate? If you can find some tire chains at the Goodwill , even a sedan can get through almost any muddy road or snowfall with chains.

A couple of good, heavy duty tarps and some rope in the trunk of your car will mean you can shelter and stay dry. A good sleeping bag and comfortable pad means you can stay warm and rested. Even better would be an RV or a 3/4 ton truck with mud/snow tires & a bed topper.

Survival is about not being on the beach when the tidal wave crests. You already see that coming. All you need now is a plan!

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This is a great thread and the many responses are very enlightening and interesting. I have really enjoyed reading them.

I think balance between physical, emotional, mental and spiritual are necessary. There are times when one aspect takes precedent but on the whole if we dont remain balanced we can lose perspective.

Money is an interesting subject. I learned to turn that one over to my Higher Power long ago. I used to be a very free spirit. My preference would have been a life of very few possessions, frequent travel and living on faith. I did that in my younger days and God never failed to provide what I needed. I learned to trust at a young age.

Children changed all that and now I have a lot of stuff. I still find stuff a burden and struggle with the balance of living a normal life, preparing for when the SHTF and wanting to have very few possessions.

In any case I feel very sure I was guided to not only to buy preps but to buy PMS and a certain stock that is making me crazy. Its sort of a strange story. When and if that stock pays off or leaves me broke it will be conformation that the voices are real or Im just nuts. :)